[mythtv-users] Odds of Linux CableCARD support?

Joe Votour joevph at yahoo.com
Wed Jan 11 17:21:08 UTC 2006



--- Jason Werpy <jwwerpy at gmail.com> wrote:

> On 1/10/06, Joe Votour <joevph at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Yeechang Lee <ylee at pobox.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Jonathan Oexner <jonathan.oexner at alum.wpi.edu>
> says:
> > > > Yeah, I was happy to learn that RCN Boston
> doesn't
> > > use 5C
> > > > encryption.
> > >
> > > I'm happy to report that RCN San Francisco does
> not
> > > either.
> > >
> > > Once CableCARD 2.0 ships, what do y'all think
> are
> > > the odds of a
> > > PCI-slot expansion board that comes with one or
> two
> > > CableCARD slots,
> > > *regardless of Linux support*? I figure that
> having
> > > the hardware
> > > actually available (as opposed to slots only
> being
> > > available on new,
> > > presumably MCE-enabled, PCs) is more than 50% of
> > > getting MythTV
> > > support done, and if it takes binary, non-free
> > > drivers for Linux
> > > support--� la Nvidia or ATi--I don't mind as
> long
> > as
> > > they
> > > work.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Yeechang Lee <ylee at pobox.com> | +1 650 776 7763
> |
> > > San Francisco CA US
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > mythtv-users mailing list
> > > mythtv-users at mythtv.org
> > >
> >
>
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> > >
> >
> > It's hard to say whether or not there would be a
> PCI
> > board.  The only design that I've heard of with
> > CableCARD (1.0) support was a Shuttle (I think)
> > machine, and thus, it was built into the
> motherboard.
> > Normally I'd say that some company would just
> > manufacture them unlicensed, but they'd be slapped
> > with some sort of DMCA lawsuit, likely.  Then I'd
> say,
> > manufacture and sell them outside of the U.S., but
> I'm
> > not even sure if CableCARD has been proposed
> outside
> > of North America.  (CableLabs is the CableCARD and
> > DOCSIS specifications writer in the United States,
> > Europe, although they have EuroDOCSIS, it is done
> by a
> > different consortium of European cable operators).
> >
> > I'm predicting 0% chance of official CableCARD
> support
> > in Linux.  Unofficially, there might be binary
> > drivers, but I really doubt that.  I'm pretty sure
> > that Microsoft had to jump through hoops to get
> > CableCARD support allowed in MCE (CableLabs is
> pretty
> > bad, I've worked for two companies that dealt with
> > them), and anything that is seen as an "open
> platform"
> > is just begging to get the big red rubber stamp of
> > denial.
> >
> > To me, the bigger challenge is not necessarily
> whether
> > or not a PCI card could be reverse engineered
> (because
> > it could, it just takes a talented person with the
> > right equipment, even if they encrypt everything
> on
> > the bus), but what kind of data the CableCARD
> gives
> > us.  If the data that we get from the CableCARD is
> > completely encrypted, then we'll be limited in the
> > things we can do with it (commercial flagging
> would
> > likely not be possible, since MythTV has to
> analyze
> > the contents of the stream).
> >
> > I would really like a legitmate CableCARD solution
> for
> > Linux, but I want it to have the current
> featureset of
> > analog cable.  Wishful thinking, I know.
> >
> > -- Joe
> >
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> >
> 
> The newest HDTivo uses cablecard.   I think there is
> a chance of making it
> work in Linux.
> 
> The more I keep looking at the state of HD
> television that they are trying
> to roll out the more I get the impression that they
> want to give us "a much
> better picture" in exchanged for us not continuing
> to time shift anymore.
> So we'll have resolution and detail for the 21st
> century and usability and
> flexibiltiy from the 1970's.
> > _______________________________________________
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>
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> 

I should have clarified my original statement - the
only PC design I know of with CableCARD is the Shuttle
one.  I did hear of the HDTivo recently as well. 
There might be other PC CableCARD implementations, but
I haven't followed the news on them because I have no
interest in CableCARD at this point (the place where I
live does their own analog cable).

I have no doubt that it can be made to work under
Linux - Tivo is likely (still) using Linux, and after
reading the CableCARD (or was is OCAP?  I don't
remember) application documents, they have to make
sure that this thing is literally an unhackable box. 
At least enough to make plausable deniability, so no
PCI slots and everything embedded into one PCB with
encryption and keeping the CableCARD driver non-GPL'd
should satisfy CableLabs.  A generic PC is much
harder.

Hollywood places too great a value on their content. 
The cable operators are in the middle.  They (at least
some of the ones I've dealt with indirectly) want to
provide good service to the customer, but their hands
are tied by the media companies.  Things like ABC
forcing the operators to carry ABC Family if they want
to carry ESPN.

The cable companies will wind up killing shooting
themselves in the foot if they're not careful.  IPTV
over DSL using MPEG-4 is steadily catching up.

-- Joe

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